Pop Matters OBTN review

[schnucams]

Nov 4, 2008 15:21:05 GMT Banana Sam said:

Simply put, Filmore couldn't cut it as a musician himself and now belittles other people's work to fill the empty void. Like coolcamarogirl said he will hate anything even remotely mainstream - yeah, because he resents other people excelling at something he's not.

That said, I don't think OBTN is KOL's strongest album so don't think I'm some rabid fangirl who thinks they can do no wrong, it's just that this isn't a review - it's out and out bitterness and an example of poor journalism.

Completely agree, karma!!!

[kat]

I didn't notice this thread before, but i just attempted to read the whole interview without laughing (or falling asleep! gosh, that was very long and repetitive - Nickelback, this, Nickelback that!) - i almost choked on my gum when Paris Hilton was mentioned!

I think this Filmore guy is a bit jealous as the kings are out playing to thousands of fans while he is sitting green in front of his laptop typing up this load of tripe!

Yeah, i probably am a little bias but i also realise that KOL aren't perfect!

[sxesadie]

...I don't understand why when someone gives the guys a bad review everyone automatically says "he's jealous" or "he hates mainstream music."

Let's look at the honest facts here: Filmore is a music critic who grew up on the Beatles (one of the most mainstream bands known to man). His job is to CRITIQUE albums. He doesn't need sources or research, his job is to listen to an album and give his opinion and regardless whether we agree or not its his right to not like them.

Also OBTN isn't just being badly reviewed by Filmore, this is sadly the boys worst reviewed album by fans and critics alike. Yes it's doing well financially but that's because it has a much more mainstream sound than the last three which is the reason that people dislike it. not because Kings are going mainstream but because they are abandoning the sound and style that gave them the fan base they have right now.

[Banana Sam]

Nov 5, 2008 6:18:09 GMT sxesadie said:

...I don't understand why when someone gives the guys a bad review everyone automatically says "he's jealous" or "he hates mainstream music."

It's because the whole article has a really bitter tone to it as it isn't just saying he doesn't like the album (which is fine, he's entitled to his opinion) but at times it seems like he's making personal attacks which is unprofessional. And the reason I said it was poor journalism was because of the tacked on Sarah Palin comments which were just plain confusing.

[schnucams]

Nov 5, 2008 6:18:09 GMT sxesadie said:

...I don't understand why when someone gives the guys a bad review everyone automatically says "he's jealous" or "he hates mainstream music."

Let's look at the honest facts here: Filmore is a music critic who grew up on the Beatles (one of the most mainstream bands known to man). His job is to CRITIQUE albums. He doesn't need sources or research, his job is to listen to an album and give his opinion and regardless whether we agree or not its his right to not like them.

Also OBTN isn't just being badly reviewed by Filmore, this is sadly the boys worst reviewed album by fans and critics alike. Yes it's doing well financially but that's because it has a much more mainstream sound than the last three which is the reason that people dislike it. not because Kings are going mainstream but because they are abandoning the sound and style that gave them the fan base they have right now.

Are you Filmore??? Be honest!!

[sxesadie]

Nov 5, 2008 20:37:44 GMT schnucams said:

Are you Filmore??? Be honest!!

Well now that you mention it... lol. No I'm not I'm just a fan of KOL but can see why alot of fans/critics don't like the new album because to be frank I don't either. I've tried to make myself listen to it over and over but I can't lie to myself and pretend that I like it, hell I listened to that album stoned and still couldn't get into it. It's just a major disappointment because I KNOW the boys are so much better than OBTN.

Also I'm an aspiring critic (not music though) so I had to defend a fellow critic.

[montana]

Nov 5, 2008 21:14:09 GMT sxesadie said:

Also I'm an aspiring critic (not music though) so I had to defend a fellow critic.

Criticism:

"should be, an elite enterprise, ideally undertaken by individuals who bring something to the party beyond their hasty, instinctive opinions of a book (or any other cultural object). It is work that requires disciplined taste, historical and theoretical knowledge and a fairly deep sense of the author’s (or filmmaker’s or painter’s) entire body of work, among other qualities.

Opinion – thumbs up, thumbs down – is the least important aspect of reviewing. Very often, in the best reviews, opinion is conveyed without a judgmental word being spoken, because the review’s highest business is to initiate intelligent dialogue about the work in question, beginning a discussion that, in some cases, will persist down the years, even down the centuries"
Quoted from:
(http://articles.latimes.com/2007/may/20/opinion/op-schickel20)


Critics DO need to use sources and to do research if they are to produce professional and FAIR work, otherwise any old hack could do it. While it may annoy me to see the Kings get a bad review, i'm an adult and can cope with it. But bad reviewing/critiqueing and slagging off for the sake of it really pisses me off.

Please dont think i'm having a go at ya but i really do think its important to recognise the work and effort an artist has invested even if the final product is not to your taste.

[princeofleon]

Nov 4, 2008 8:46:11 GMT coolcamarogirl said:

About Filmore Mescalito Holmes

Filmore is an opinionated miser from Vancouver, British Columbia. His mother raised him on a solid diet of Frank Zappa and The Beatles, so classic psychedelia is the cornerstone of his aesthetic. In the late '90s, he formed an unhealthy addiction to used records and he fell into hip-hop (gangsta before Ninja Tune opened his eyes), indie and alt-rock, and all manner of electronica (except most funky house). Though most of his college tuition ended up spent on magazines and vinyl, it was Almost Famous that introduced him to the power of Lester Bangs and really planted the seeds to get in the rock journalism game. Since dropping out of college in the early naughties, he has been spewing reviews from behind the safety of a laptop. Reflecting a heavy Hunter S. Thompson and Bill Hicks influence, his goal is to be graphically honest, brutally penetrating, and reasonably fair. Most mainstream products make him convulse, so he tends to focus on the ever-expanding underground fringes emerging from the shadow of the dying RIAA. However, he keeps an open mind to new experiences, as there are exceptions to every rule. Simply put, music is his religion.
(source: Popmatters.com)

Filmore Mescalito Holmes abuses animals.
(source:princeofleon at happyalone.com

Hope y'all enjoy my review.quote]

[Jigglytuffy™]

*likes the new album as well as the old crap too*

With that being said, what this guy did wasn't reviewing, regardless of what everyone thinks. If you can't see the personal attacks, then I don't know what to tell you. He turned what was suppose to be a review into something deeper and personal, and it's rather blatant and annoying. I could give a rats ass about his "personal" opinion of them. He's suppose to be REVIEWING THE DAMN ALBUM. And sorry, but that was not what he ended up doing, intentionally or not. I could do a better ass critique than this lame ass guy, without sounding too biased or too opinionated.

On second thought, this guy probably hasn't even listened to the rest of the Kings stuff, and has only written this "review" to piss people off. Don't you just hate people like that?

I wonder how much money he got paid to write this...

[sxesadie]

And I get what you all are saying but there are two types of critiques in our society. Personal and professional critiques. For instance the Rolling Stone movie reviewer Peter Travers is a personal critic, all his critiques are are just opinions of a movie. However if you read reviews from Vanity Fair or New York Times they are much more professional, unbiased, and meticulous.

Holmes is a personal critic and not even an important one. He isn't even hired by a company, he's just an average guy who does reviews for himself.

So don't worry KOL fans no need to get upset about Joe Schmo's review.

[schnucams]

Nov 5, 2008 21:14:09 GMT sxesadie said:

Well now that you mention it... lol. No I'm not I'm just a fan of KOL but can see why alot of fans/critics don't like the new album because to be frank I don't either. I've tried to make myself listen to it over and over but I can't lie to myself and pretend that I like it, hell I listened to that album stoned and still couldn't get into it. It's just a major disappointment because I KNOW the boys are so much better than OBTN.

Also I'm an aspiring critic (not music though) so I had to defend a fellow critic.

Fair enough!! I cant argue with that!!

I can however argue with Filmore cause, IMO, he's a plank

Nov 5, 2008 22:17:36 GMT montana said:

Criticism:

"should be, an elite enterprise, ideally undertaken by individuals who bring something to the party beyond their hasty, instinctive opinions of a book (or any other cultural object). It is work that requires disciplined taste, historical and theoretical knowledge and a fairly deep sense of the author’s (or filmmaker’s or painter’s) entire body of work, among other qualities.

Opinion – thumbs up, thumbs down – is the least important aspect of reviewing. Very often, in the best reviews, opinion is conveyed without a judgmental word being spoken, because the review’s highest business is to initiate intelligent dialogue about the work in question, beginning a discussion that, in some cases, will persist down the years, even down the centuries"
Quoted from:
(http://articles.latimes.com/2007/may/20/opinion/op-schickel20)


Critics DO need to use sources and to do research if they are to produce professional and FAIR work, otherwise any old hack could do it. While it may annoy me to see the Kings get a bad review, i'm an adult and can cope with it. But bad reviewing/critiqueing and slagging off for the sake of it really pisses me off.

Please dont think i'm having a go at ya but i really do think its important to recognise the work and effort an artist has invested even if the final product is not to your taste.

K.A.R.M.A

[ILoveTheRazzleKid]

I don't understand why people were attacking sawyer in this thread, when he's only posting a review?!!! Bit unnecessary, perhaps.
'The video for “Sex on Fire” doesn’t even have a girl in it. It’s got a dude eating chicken then ripping pages out of the Bible, another taking a shower in a warehouse, a bunch of winter gloves on sticks, and three guys touching Caleb until he pukes black dust in between shots of the band lip-synching.' made me laugh, but apart from that, the rest of the review was fairly predictable and only mildly entertaining from the perspective that he clearly is the kind of man (hopefully voluptuous!) who resented the 'dude' eating chicken primarily because he wasn't eating it.
I like OBTN but it is my least favourite album, as i've probably said numerous times, sorry.

[schnucams]

I dont think anyone is being attacked in this thread, people are having a difference of opinion thats all, imo!!!